Dan Lewis - Latest Comments

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Dan121377 — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 15:19:36 -0000

Except that I am also giving them the rest of my library, and that's
unreasonable.

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Daniel — Thu, 03 Dec 2009 15:06:35 -0000

Hi:

if you let somebody borrow the actual Kindle where the e-book is stored, then in a sense you are extending the traditional ownership rights.

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Dan121377 — Wed, 02 Dec 2009 22:02:06 -0000

I don't like the tangible item plus license dichotomy. It's just not necessary. Ownership of a tangible (or even intangible) item doesn't entitle the owner to use the the item in unlawful ways. You can't bash in mailboxes or skulls with a lawfully-owned baseball bat, for example. But calling that a licensing issue makes something simple rather complicated.

As for your subpoints:

1) Operationally, it's difficult to prevent downstream resales of used items, but, if it were unlawful, it'd not be nearly as difficult as you think. Libraries and used book vendors would immediately cease to exist, leaving only peer-to-peer lending/sales. You couldn't eradicate it but you could hamper it dramatically.

2) I agree. DRM is a bad attempt to solve the problem I'm articulating. What we need, legislatively and technologically, is a framework which meets our already-existing vision of how ownership works. DRM does not do that, at all, for the reasons you articulated and others.

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

John — Wed, 02 Dec 2009 10:59:14 -0000

When you purchase a book you are actually purchasing a license for the interlectual property rights and a physical book. There are limitations. You can't for example photocopy the book and sell it.

The simplification comes because the license is linked to the physical object both legally and also as a physical copy protection. It is difficult to "copy" a book and everyone understands that isn't allowed.

There are two important differences though...
1) Because it is effectively impossible to enforce limitiations on transfering the book + license then sellers don't actually limit this use. However they do use other means to do this. For example text book publishers regularly bring out new editions reducing the ability of students to resell books to the next cohort of students. However the technical mechanisms to prevent copying are equally effective at preventing transfers and so publishers have chosen to limit transfer rights. They don't have to but it is in their interests to. This appears just to be a fact of life. One of those "can't do anything about" issues we should have serenity about.

2) The technical mechanisms used to enforce license limitations (DRM) are by nessessity proprietry to prevent people from reverse engineering them to bypass the protections. They also rely on a DRM infrastructure to validate a copy so it can be used on a specific device. The problem for the consumer is that when you buy a physical book then if the publisher goes out of business they still own the book and it doesn't become unusable. However with DRM protected purchases if the proprietry software is not updated and maintained so it can be used on the latest devices and operating systems or if the DRM infrastructure is not maintained and kept operational then the purchase can become unusable at exactly the point when it is no longer viable to recover compensation from the supplier. Here there are possibilities to protect the consumer. For example it could be a legal requirement to place unprotected copies of DRM protected purchases into escro. If a purchaser can demonstrate they can no longer use the purchase and the supplier is no longer trading then an unprotected copy could be provided. This would appear to be an area where we should have the courage to demand changes of our legislators.

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Dan121377 — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 18:29:58 -0000

Even if you're right, my point is that it shouldn't be negotiable. Too many options blurs an otherwise clear line.

Whether we can get to a clear line is another problem, of course.

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Dan121377 — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 18:28:09 -0000

Yeah so, uh... why'd I click that link...

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

Miracle Jones — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 18:24:33 -0000

How about keeping it simple by publishing ebooks as digital sculptures that you can have and hold?

Like this:

http://www.fictioncircus.com/news.php?id=483&mo...

Re: What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

asciilifeform — Tue, 01 Dec 2009 15:47:27 -0000

> What Does it Mean to “Buy” an E-book?

It means that money has left your bank account. Literally everything else is negotiable.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Gahoo — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:02:49 -0000

Whoops. Didn't see the other comments when I posted.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

asciilifeform — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 14:01:32 -0000

> If you do the former, you own it; the latter, someone else does.

As soon as the contents of the file are in my bought-and-paid-for-with-no-fine-print-just-like-a-fork-or-a-knife video card's display buffer, I have taken ownership of them, Talmudic legal fictions notwithstanding. A copy is made in all cases, whether for my own viewing after I have been properly bled (Officially Blessed variant) or obtained from a warez site, with intent to distribute to the entire population of China (Officially Not Blessed.) The physical process which took place is the same.

No argument about the cloud. Once you store data on a hostile machine, others may read, delete, modify, etc. it. The only machine which contains data that can be meaningfully called "yours" is your own.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Gahoo — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:52:41 -0000

Barnes & Nobel have apparently picked up on this concept, and their "Nook" allows e-book sharing. http://www.barnesandnoble.com/nook/support/?cds...

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Dan121377 — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:52:32 -0000

Eh, it's not really sharing, because you don't actually own the book.
It's just a reassignment of DRM nonsense and I think a previous
commenter is correct -- it'll prove to be an "anti-feature".

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Dan121377 — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:51:33 -0000

Re: and/or: Sure. But you can either put the file on your computer (DRM notwithstanding) or host it on the cloud. If you do the former, you own it; the latter, someone else does.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Gahoo — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:51:29 -0000

Barnes & Nobel have apparently picked up on this concept, and their "Nook" allows e-book sharing. http://www.barnesandnoble.com/nook/support/?cds...

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

asciilifeform — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:45:25 -0000

> I don't see any of this as an "or" question

Whether I have absolute control over the fate of bits on a device which I bought and physically possess is, in fact, an either-or question. Either my computer is built to disobey my orders to benefit a hostile third party, or it is not: http://glyf.livejournal.com/46589.html

> But we both agree that the "easy" solution is not a solution at all

There are only two long-term solutions: a ban on true general-purpose computing (the logical conclusion of DRM efforts) or the complete abandonment of artificial scarcity. The latter could involve a clever social hack (i.e. the "ransom" model) or a reversion to the (historically dominant) situation of largely unpaid creativity.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Dan121377 — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:36:31 -0000

The reply I just left for the commentor below probably applies to a large degree to yours as well. I don't see any of this as an "or" question -- we should be able to buy access without possession, possession without ownership, and I'm sure tons of other delineations which I can't think of. The reason for DRM -- beyond the most aggressive of thieves -- is to help make these bundles of rights meaningful, and more importantly and in the short term (I hope!) to make for an "easy" solution: an us versus them game and appeals to legal questions. But we both agree that the "easy" solution is not a solution at all.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Dan121377 — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:33:23 -0000

Yeah :) It'd be like letting someone live in my apartment (while I
went elsewhere) so they could read something on my bookshelf!

I think the Rhapsody angle is correct, in general if not specifically.
Here's what I wrote on Mike Shatzkin's blog. I think the issue is
that we need different solutions for different intents:

"It sounds like a "bundle of rights" problem. If I buy ("own") a book,
I expect to be able to do things such as re-sell, loan, rent, gift it.
If I rent or borrow ("posses") a book, I don't, but expect to be able
to do things like take it with me on a trip. If I am in your house and
flip through ("access") a book, you being a mensch aside, I probably
can't just walk out the door with it."

So if I buy a book or e-book, it should come with as many ownership
rights as possible. If I rent/borrow it, then the bundle I get is the
possession one. Etc. I recognize, of course, that having the ability
to copy the book and not the right is a bit of a muddle, especially as
the marginal cost to copy goes to zero, but I think that allowing the
other bundles of rights to exist in the commerce stream helps mitigate
that.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Todd — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:27:14 -0000

You could certainly lend your kindle to soneone else in order for them to read a book. And just like a real book you would be without it until it was returned. :-)

However, what is probably needed is an Rhapsody for books.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

asciilifeform — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 13:21:47 -0000

> they would (in fact) allow for lending if it came with artificial scarcity

My point was that the level of scarcity we have grown used to from our experience with the "dead tree" world will not satisfy the publishers, as it could easily be transformed into a free-for-all. How many of the books on your shelves are not in your hands right this very instant? Well, if those were fully lendable e-books, someone in China could be reading them. And they would be right where they belong in ten seconds' time, should you decide to pick one up on a whim. The veil of scarcity wears thin, because e-books are able to teleport while paper ones are not.

> you're couching it in terms which should be irrelevant -- DRM, specifically.

DRM is permanently relevant to any discussion of the e-book. Anything which wraps what would otherwise be an ordinary data file (cloud or not) and renders it artificially scarce is a form of DRM. A turd by any other name, etc. Overall, any technology which attempts to restrict what a user can do with an array of bits in his physical possession is an instance of DRM. Anything which maintains scarcity is by definition DRM, because naked bits alone can never be scarce: http://ansuz.sooke.bc.ca/lawpoli/colour/2004061...

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

Dan121377 — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 12:53:51 -0000

I think book publishers are a bit less afraid of the digital world than music labels, and that they would (in fact) allow for lending if it came with artificial scarcity. First, there's something special about the reading experience from dead tree books; second, they look great on a bookshelf (see Battelle's notes); and finally, music doesn't really exist in a tangible medium outside of distribution. That last point applies to books as well, but for some reason, feels different.

As for B&N's feature, you're couching it in terms which should be irrelevant -- DRM, specifically. The cloud format renders DRM meaningless (See Mike's reply to http://www.idealog.com/blog/fighting-piracy-our...) while similarly maintaining scarcity.

Re: The Used Book Store in the Cloud

asciilifeform — Mon, 30 Nov 2009 12:22:36 -0000

The copyright cartels will never allow an extension of the customary "dead tree" unlimited right-to-lend to e-books, as that way lies the ultimate collapse of artificial scarcity, something they live in mortal dread of. I discuss this issue at length in my debunking of the B&N Nook's lending feature: http://www.loper-os.org/?p=54

Re: My 5 Item Wishlist for This Mets Offseason

Dan121377 — Wed, 07 Oct 2009 22:09:04 -0000

It's not the players. At least not the good ones.
Wright/Reyes/Beltran got us a pitch away from the 2006 WS. They're
the reason the Mets were in the hunt in 2007 with a patently bad
pitching staff and in 2008 with an overtaxed and under-talented
bullpen (and no corner OFs).

Re: My 5 Item Wishlist for This Mets Offseason

bigdlah — Wed, 07 Oct 2009 22:06:19 -0000

I would never give up on the Mets, but I have given up on this particular group of players. I no longer wish to root for David Wright, Jose Reyes, and Carlos Beltran. Does that make me any less of a fan, I dont think so and Im sure Im not alone. These guys are not winners (clearly, they continue to loose). I agree with your sentiments concerning Minaya, Wilpon, and Manuel but at some point we have to acknowledge that the core of this team is fatally flawed. If the "leaders" of this team remain, I expect a similar result, maybe more wins but no real success. I will leave my wallet closed until that changes

Re: My 5 Item Wishlist for This Mets Offseason

Dan121377 — Tue, 06 Oct 2009 21:15:09 -0000

Thanks for the comments!

Re: My 5 Item Wishlist for This Mets Offseason

Mets_on_Deck — Tue, 06 Oct 2009 21:08:38 -0000

Gotta admit, I read Greg's post in Faith and Fear and he mentioned your post (with a link) along with Dana Brand and MetsGrrl.

I wrote more about Madoff and the Mets on my blog as well. When operating in a vacuum (no information from the Mets), we are all left to guess. Richard Joel's letter was very sobering, well done, and settled the issue -- once -- and for all. Thank you for sharing that.

Tom from Mets on Deck